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Post by muzzleofbees on Apr 9, 2021 0:54:33 GMT -5
1) I say this loving AKM, including Sketchy Metal, beyond belief, but: Separation Sunday is a special work of art. I'm not gonna spoil the list, but I'll say this: I was suprised of how high I rated so many Almost Killed Me songs. Actually, I think 7 out of 10 tracks ranked inside top 30. Still, Separation Sunday edges it as the better album to me. And that only shows that albums are something else than the sum of the songs on it. And, yes, Separation Sunday is really special for me too. I don't really make sense to compare it to In The Aeroplane Over The Sea, Blood On The Tracks, Abbey Road, Velvet Underground or Yankee Hotel Foxtrot, cause they're all perfect in their own way, but Separation Sunday might be my favourite album of all time.
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Post by muzzleofbees on Apr 9, 2021 1:01:19 GMT -5
#49: HOT FRIES
I came late to the party (pun partially intended) on this one, and I think that’s part of the reason it still sounds fresh to me. It’s one of the rockiest songs in the entire catalog, all fuzz and no afterthought. And it’s one of the songs in the catalog closest to Lifter Puller, in my opinion. A counterpart to Secret Santa Cruz.
I’m not sure if I would call it “simple”, but it’s very straight forward, still carefully constructed in the way that it keeps building energy and intensity. The chourses feels like such a release, even if they just bang along in the same style as the verses. The Big Moment for me is when they turn the screw another turn when they kick off the final part, the “It’s my party and I’ll die if I want to” - which is also a contender for the most Hold Steady-esqe line of all Hold Steady lines.
I would live to hear this live, I think it would be such a blast. And I keep putting it on playlists, intended to show what Hold Steady is all about.
Final points:
- There's plenty of references to getting "fried" in the Hold Steady lyrics, but if I remember right, there's not many mention of "fries" at such? This also feels like a callback to Lifter Puller, with the "we loaded up on the curly fries" line - At Massive Nights 2017 they sold a really cool grey shirt with an Andy Capp and Hot Friest theme. I use it pretty frequently
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Post by muzzleofbees on Apr 9, 2021 1:16:21 GMT -5
#48: PARADE DAYS
I’ve talked a fair bit about soft songs, sweet songs, simple songs and slow songs during this ranking. It goes a long way to show my uninventiveness when it comes to these characteristics, but it’s also handy labels talking about a rock band who uses these type of songs as contrast to their regular routine. Some of these songs are “just” simple, sweet or slow. That’s not a takedown, really, it’s more an aknowledgment of their function. But others take on a different gravitas, and transcends into another vague, and silly category: Important songs. By that, I don’t mean songs who actually are important to anyone in particular, not even myself. It’s an attempt to describe the song’s soul or identity, what it carries inside. I get that this sounds gibberish, but it’s a useful way for me to separate and categorize.
Parade Days is the rare case of a seemingly throwaway song, with the confusing status as a) a bonus track, and b) a song treated as a part of the album it accompany. And it’s the rare case of a song both sweet, simple, soft and slow, AND of gravitas and depth. I can’t quite pinpoint why it feels like this, but there’s something about the lyrics, who both on paper and when delivered, sounds more earnest, heartfelt and filled with real meaning, than many other songs. Musically, it’s mostly sweet, but with subtle twists they add a notion of swirling drama, like a sea of emotion coming to life inside the narrator, and threats of bad weather on the horizon.
I think they - if they wanted to - could have made this not only important, but Big, and turned it into an album centerpiece or even a closer. But I kind of love that they didn’t. That they left it there as a gem right at the end, an afterthough, a footnote carrying more meaning than big parts of the body it annotates.
Final points:
- This is a Steve song, musically, and somewhere (on Twitter during the listening party?) he talked about this was a song who was mostly finished musically before Craig added all the lyrics, and how Steve didn't listen to any of it before it was all finished. He said something like this made him able to for once hear the song as a fan, in awe of what Craig have done with it. I think that was quite beautiful - This song is just full of these tiny little images that are so heavy and on point, who's also something Craig is amazingly good at. Like the thing about the bags at the bus stop. It's so simple, yet so effective - Lots of stuff about parades on Open Door Policy, and interesting that they put it in a title too
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Post by muzzleofbees on Apr 9, 2021 1:26:43 GMT -5
#47: EPAULETS
I fucking LOVED Epaulets when Thrashing arrived. The way we’re throwed straight into this hectic, hasty rush of rock’n’roll, and how the band suddenly come into focus at “…it’s sweet, cause I’m a sucked for the dictator chic”. It’s a song I’m at some point of my life would have found a little to messy. It offers no real place to getting to know the song, it starts off, and you’re suddenly in the middle of everything. I think I’m more able to appreciate it know, just roll along and feel the rush.
But it’s not exactly noise rock either, there’s plenty of pop sensibilites here. I think the chours, both melodically, but especially how they do it arrangment wise, is pretty perfect. It reminds me of some of the stuff they do in Spinners, which is a magnificent example of pop sensibilites mixed with great musicianship and wise production choices. Epaulets isn’t all the way up there, but it does the same thing.
At certain points the past two years, I could have ranked this way higher. When I’ve pushed it at little further down the list, it’s because that inital rush wears a little bit off, the excitement over the hectic blaze fades a little on repeated listens. I still think it’s a great song, though, and I greatly appreciate that this also was a part of Hold Steady’s arsenal when they returned for real.
Final points:
- "Epaulets", the word, joined a list of words I had to google when I first read it, and therefore also the list of english words Hold Steady have though me the meaning of (see also: Sequestered, transverberate and others) - In an interview a few years back, Craig talks about his childhood memories of hearing Slip Slidin' Away, and I can't help thinking that the "Dolores" is a reference back to that one
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Post by thehudsonsteady on Apr 9, 2021 2:17:47 GMT -5
This list is taking over my life! Glad to see some appreciation for 'Epaulets' and 'Esther', both two of my favourites from 'THS Mk2'. Love your summing up of the albums too, you really captured something there. Keep up the fantastic/mad work.
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Post by muzzleofbees on Apr 9, 2021 3:58:55 GMT -5
This list is taking over my life! Glad to see some appreciation for 'Epaulets' and 'Esther', both two of my favourites from 'THS Mk2'. Love your summing up of the albums too, you really captured something there. Keep up the fantastic/mad work. Thanks, man! I really appreciate it.
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Post by muzzleofbees on Apr 9, 2021 4:18:25 GMT -5
#46: FIRST NIGHT
I don’t want to come off as condescening or sound like I’m crying sellout when I talk about this stuff, but it is pretty obvious to me that Hold Steady at some point took conscious creative decisions in an attempt to rise above midlevel indie status, and into something bigger: I think they were in every right to do so, and it’s not like they made all-too-obvious compromises, or morphed into something else. And not only that, the time they did it, was at the same time lots of us actually falled in love with them.
To me, this perspective is more about understanding how and why the developed, and to seperate their different phases.
I start off with this observation because First Night, more than Stations, more than Chips Ahoy!, underlines this developement. Hold Steady had made ballads before, but nothing even remotely close to a ballad like this. A big, expanded and blossoming ballad with the piano in the very front, Craig sort of crooning, everything on top of a quite big riff. Certain Songs is a piano heavy ballad, but it’s grittier. Killer Parties is more romantic, and probably the only contender, but it’s still rockier, in the vein of the album. And How A Resurrection really feels is a sort-of ballad, but it’s more playful, less textbook ballad.
First Night is, all the way down to it’s title, which is catchier and more universal.
The final part of the song is perhaps what’s rooting it in the previous relases. The harmonies leading up to it are beautiful, but almost too much - when the final part kicks in for contrast, it becomes pretty perfect.
As I touched into in another text, this is probably a better song than a few of the ones to come. It’s just that no matter how good a big ballad is, I will close to always prefer the faster, rockier tunes. Still, First Night is pretty amazing.
Final points:
- One of my best friend, a guy who came along to both Cologne and Brooklyn to hear the band, have First Night as his a) first meeting with the band, and b) favourite song still - I think this is a song who actually works better on reecord than live, along with a few other Boys And Girls tracks (well, Party Pit, at least). There's something in the interplay between the piano and the guitars, and also in the way Craig sings, who actually benefits from the production and studio-added atmosphere. I like it live too, but some of it's magic gets lost, it just doesn't flow in the same way
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Post by star18 on Apr 9, 2021 8:57:37 GMT -5
I'm really glad to see the "Esther" love, I think that's an unbelievably gorgeous song. And just joining in to say how enjoyable this whole thread has been to follow along with!
The band's official releases are all 10 or 11 songs (for as wildly inventive as the songwriting is, they're pretty traditional about album construction) so I think that's the (entirely artificial for my purposes) benchmark to meet. Which is surprisingly hard for THS! You've got around 35 contenders for those 11 spots, and a lot of those are really wonderful songs.
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Post by muzzleofbees on Apr 9, 2021 14:36:05 GMT -5
#45: STAY POSITIVE
Stay Positive is most definitely a classic Hold Steady song. The title track of one of their most popular albums, turned into a statement in itself, and appearing on setlists most nights. It’s also a pretty obvious hommage to hardcore and the scene back in the day. Not only in the lyrics, but also in the strumming riff and the general attitude of the song (which obviously isn’t hardcore, but you can tell where those chords come from).
I enjoy screaming along live, and I even enjoy Moshpit Josh moshing it out, but I’m pretty cold on it playing it in my own living room. I guess I’ve said enough about the hard, cold and un-melodic songs, but this is the prime example.
So why on the upper half of the list? Well, I guess it’s such a integral part of the band and their legacy, that it gives me some sort of enjoyment anyway. And I don’t hate listening to it all, it’s just one of those songs where my opinion seem to be furthest away from how the band and the fans rate it.
Final points:
- I still get a little touched thinking about that callback line about the unified scene, and everything that entity turned out to be
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Post by muzzleofbees on Apr 9, 2021 14:40:27 GMT -5
#44: STAR 18
After the intial rush of Entitlement Crew late in 2017, hearing this was the next big rush for me. A rush of pop, rock, melody and energy, just a very light-hearted but still intense rock’n’roll tune. I think what I enjoy most about it is how dynamic it is, from the very stringent verses, where Craig ramble away over a supertight, but not extremely melodic riff, and the the transition into the sugar coated explosion in the chours. THIS is how I want my chourses! There’s so many small push/release pairs here, in a very short span of time, guitars cranking up, letting it flow, then pulling it back in again. Does that make any sense? It’s how I feel it, anyway.
This is also a case of Craig pouring out lines I don’t immediatley catch the narrative purpose of, but who just sounds so damn cool. All that stuff about Spokane, Peter Tosh and the joke about the girl at the zoo, Mick Jagger, Hemmingway and quicksilver sprawl. All anchored by a classic Craig line who sounds like a phrase that’s been around forever: “Once you get good you can get it whereever you are”. I’m not saying this is all genius, I’m just saying it sounds realy good, evocative and fun and free-flowing.
There’s lot of great rock songs in this catalog, and plenty of sweet slow jams too. But there’s really not that many pitch perfect poprock songs, a handful or two, maybe. This is one of them to me.
Final points:
- I wonder if the 212-Margarita and 612-Bloody Mary, who I assume on some level reference phone numbers, have any connection to dialing *-1-8 on the rotary dial
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Post by muzzleofbees on Apr 9, 2021 14:42:09 GMT -5
#43: MILKCRATE MOSH
“You know, the gin was just like Gideon”. That’s how everything starts, the first line of the first song Hold Steady released. I was still three years away from hearing a single note from them, but you can sort of sense that this is an origin story.
Isn’t it a pretty unique song in the catalog? The wandering and almost stoner like groove just worming its way through the song, Craig sounding like he’s buried not only in the mix, but somewhere in the studio too, big and anachronistic guitar licks over a steady beat. It’s pretty weird, but it’s also very cool. And when Craig goes all the way down in the Denver slums, and take the band with him, you wonder if it’s just gonna fizzle out. It doesn’t it kick back harder than ever, literally louder, even, and they finish of with a final guitar excess.
So many lines and verses here who makes the narrative brain going into overdrive, and it’s like a crash course, an extremely condensed introduction to the entire universe. That might be the most important thing about the song, how it feels like opening a can of myth. I can’t really explain why I dig it, but I assure you, it’s this far up the list cause it feels special.
Final points:
- It just occured to me that I don't know if I've ever heard the b-side, the Zeppelin cover. Imagine being a obsessive fan of a band for thirteen-fourteen years, and still have a unheard song of theirs. Hah.
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Post by kayfaberaven on Apr 9, 2021 17:50:23 GMT -5
#47: EPAULETSI fucking LOVED Epaulets when Thrashing arrived. The way we’re throwed straight into this hectic, hasty rush of rock’n’roll, and how the band suddenly come into focus at “…it’s sweet, cause I’m a sucked for the dictator chic”. It’s a song I’m at some point of my life would have found a little to messy. It offers no real place to getting to know the song, it starts off, and you’re suddenly in the middle of everything. I think I’m more able to appreciate it know, just roll along and feel the rush.
But it’s not exactly noise rock either, there’s plenty of pop sensibilites here. I think the chours, both melodically, but especially how they do it arrangment wise, is pretty perfect. It reminds me of some of the stuff they do in Spinners, which is a magnificent example of pop sensibilites mixed with great musicianship and wise production choices. Epaulets isn’t all the way up there, but it does the same thing.
At certain points the past two years, I could have ranked this way higher. When I’ve pushed it at little further down the list, it’s because that inital rush wears a little bit off, the excitement over the hectic blaze fades a little on repeated listens. I still think it’s a great song, though, and I greatly appreciate that this also was a part of Hold Steady’s arsenal when they returned for real. Final points: - "Epaulets", the word, joined a list of words I had to google when I first read it, and therefore also the list of english words Hold Steady have though me the meaning of (see also: Sequestered, transverberate and others) - In an interview a few years back, Craig talks about his childhood memories of hearing Slip Slidin' Away, and I can't help thinking that the "Dolores" is a reference back to that one I completely agree with being thrown straight into this song. The first half dozen times I listened to it, my brain couldn't quite catch up to the sounds at the start of the song, and it just sounded like noise until they get to "It's sweet...". Now that my brain knows what to expect from the outset, it's not an issue any more. Weird.
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charlie
Sniffling Indie Kid
Posts: 214
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Post by charlie on Apr 9, 2021 19:21:10 GMT -5
#49: HOT FRIESI came late to the party (pun partially intended) on this one, and I think that’s part of the reason it still sounds fresh to me. It’s one of the rockiest songs in the entire catalog, all fuzz and no afterthought. And it’s one of the songs in the catalog closest to Lifter Puller, in my opinion. A counterpart to Secret Santa Cruz.
I’m not sure if I would call it “simple”, but it’s very straight forward, still carefully constructed in the way that it keeps building energy and intensity. The chourses feels like such a release, even if they just bang along in the same style as the verses. The Big Moment for me is when they turn the screw another turn when they kick off the final part, the “It’s my party and I’ll die if I want to” - which is also a contender for the most Hold Steady-esqe line of all Hold Steady lines.
I would live to hear this live, I think it would be such a blast. And I keep putting it on playlists, intended to show what Hold Steady is all about. Final points: - There's plenty of references to getting "fried" in the Hold Steady lyrics, but if I remember right, there's not many mention of "fries" at such? This also feels like a callback to Lifter Puller, with the "we loaded up on the curly fries" line - At Massive Nights 2017 they sold a really cool grey shirt with an Andy Capp and Hot Friest theme. I use it pretty frequently First off, I'm really enjoying reading this even when I don't agree with it. Case in point, I realized the other day when this played that it's my least favorite Hold Steady song. Like I don't like it / would never want to hear it at a show, even though it's rare / don't think it's good.
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Post by thepeter on Apr 9, 2021 19:38:02 GMT -5
#46: FIRST NIGHTit is pretty obvious to me that Hold Steady at some point took conscious creative decisions in an attempt to rise above midlevel indie status, and into something bigger: I think they were in every right to do so, and it’s not like they made all-too-obvious compromises, or morphed into something else. And not only that, the time they did it, was at the same time lots of us actually falled in love with them So one thing I never realized until a few years ago is that there aren't any repeated choruses on the first record. Repeated lines, sure, but no Rock Song Choruses. And none on the second record excepting Hoodrat, and that's just a single line getting repeated. And I LOVE that. I generally love verses and deal with the chorus. But I heard those first two records and liked them enough to buy the third but didn't like them enough to skip seeing Built To Spill for the fiftieth time at the big muddy-sounding Crystal Ballroom even though a few blocks away the Hold Steady were playing at little Berbati's, with USE opening in summer 2005. Then the third record catches me by my tail, because of the immediacy of the choruses on the first three numbers and First Night and even the stupid acapella Southtown intro. But caught me enough to listen closer to those first couple records and really GET them. And I'll take the first couple over the third every day of the week but it took those big choruses to open my eyes (ears I guess). Anyway, I can absolutely see someone at Vagrant sitting them down and having the Chorus Talk. "Look guys I know big rock choruses are passe but you can do them well and Hoodrat proves it and that just so happens to be your biggest number. And you can keep playing clubs to the cool kids but choruses are gonna put butts in the seats."
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Post by muzzleofbees on Apr 10, 2021 11:45:22 GMT -5
#42: MILKCRATE MOSH
Hah, I just found out that I've added Milkcrate Mosh twice. So for the sake of the list, I'll put the one I forgot about in here:
#42: ARMS AND HEARTS
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Post by muzzleofbees on Apr 10, 2021 11:47:18 GMT -5
#41: LANYARDS
Remember what I wrote about The Weekenders? How it felt like a mathematically perfect rock song, but still feels a bit sterile and lifeless to me? Well, Lanyards is a little bit the flipside of that. It sounds perfectly crafted, very right in any way. But where other songs in this category falls slightly dead to me, Lanyards feels alive, breathing and very much present.
I think a lot of it comes down to arrangment, production and everything somewhere in between, the little vague intensity the band cranks up in the chourses here. Maybe it’s Bobby doing the job? I know for sure that it’s Franz who lifts the verses from what could have been a little boring, to something enticing, tingling, promising. But when the chours hit, the heat gets turned on, and I don’t fully understand why.
This is another testament to the band Hold Steady have become: How the different instrumentalists give each other room to unfold themselves, but also air and space to breathe. Everyone gets to shine here, but they take turns, don’t overplay anything, just tastefully playing up each other strenghts. It’s such a well-crafted, but ALSO exciting song.
Final points:
- I heard the live premiere of this song, at Massive Nights 2019. At least I'm pretty sure I did, I can vividly remember the "back by thanksgiving" line. It was still called Frog back then.
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Post by kayfaberaven on Apr 10, 2021 12:52:37 GMT -5
#49: HOT FRIESI came late to the party (pun partially intended) on this one, and I think that’s part of the reason it still sounds fresh to me. It’s one of the rockiest songs in the entire catalog, all fuzz and no afterthought. And it’s one of the songs in the catalog closest to Lifter Puller, in my opinion. A counterpart to Secret Santa Cruz.
I’m not sure if I would call it “simple”, but it’s very straight forward, still carefully constructed in the way that it keeps building energy and intensity. The chourses feels like such a release, even if they just bang along in the same style as the verses. The Big Moment for me is when they turn the screw another turn when they kick off the final part, the “It’s my party and I’ll die if I want to” - which is also a contender for the most Hold Steady-esqe line of all Hold Steady lines.
I would live to hear this live, I think it would be such a blast. And I keep putting it on playlists, intended to show what Hold Steady is all about. Final points: - There's plenty of references to getting "fried" in the Hold Steady lyrics, but if I remember right, there's not many mention of "fries" at such? This also feels like a callback to Lifter Puller, with the "we loaded up on the curly fries" line - At Massive Nights 2017 they sold a really cool grey shirt with an Andy Capp and Hot Friest theme. I use it pretty frequently Totally agree that it would be a blast to hear this live, if only to hear what Steve and Tad could do with the guitar interplay, which really comes through for this song on my headphones. Also, maybe to hear if Craig would update the line about Elliot Smith because he's since said that it's too mean -- maybe he could change it to "Kanye West seems like a mess to me"?
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Post by muzzleofbees on Apr 10, 2021 13:39:42 GMT -5
#40: MULTITUDE OF CAUSALTIES
There’s so many Separation Sunday songs who’s so hard to grasp, or really formulate anything meaningful about. Part of it is because I’ve heard them so many times, in so many life phases, that they just have been internalized. I know them in and out, and no longer think about different parts of the songs anymore. They’re almost holistic to me, if that makes any sense. They exist as a singular unity, almost without a beginning and an end, they just ARE.
On the contrary, I sometimes judge songs like this one, or Stevie Nix, on their intro/first parts, and intuitively forget which song morphes into what ending. And that’s pretty important when it comes to these songs. They might lack verses and chourses, but they all have distinguished and memorable parts - it’s just hard sometimes to tell which part belongs where.
Multitute is the comfort food of the Hold Steady catalog, a pretty big song hidden inside even bigger songs on Separation Sunday, encapsulating everything the band really are about, without being braggy or loudmouthed about it. The main riff is melancholic, but rocking, very good, but not mindblowing. And when the song breaks down in the who’s-where-now? segment, it feels minor in a good way. Their destiny isn’t at stake here, the characters seem human and lifelike. Even the finale, when Craig yells about Youth Services, feels a little more subdued than counterparts in other songs.
It’s just a rock solid Hold Steady song, and every time they kick into it live I start off thinking “ok, cool enough”, and when it’s over I’m like “fuck yeah!”
Final points:
- I know there's deep and dense lyrical stuff on Almost Killed Me too, but when we talk about Multitue, it remind me of how big of a change Separation Sunday feels to me - also lyrically. It's like Craig takes a step back or upwards, out the immediateness of what's going on on Almost Killed Me, and into an ellipctical, sort of god like mode of describing the events. He's not a street spider, he's a hawk. Maybe it's just a current feeling, I know there's plenty of complex stuff on AKM too, but I think there's a change going on here. - One of my other best friends, who's also crossed country borders to join me for one of those Hold Steady trips, talked about this song the first time we met. I was allready in full missionary mode, and was so happy he knew about them. It suprised me that this, of all songs, was the one he had chosen, but now I kinda dig that.
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Post by muzzleofbees on Apr 10, 2021 13:48:55 GMT -5
#39. THE AMBASSADORIn many ways, I think this is the very best ballad by Hold Steady. Within the border of what the song tries to be, it’s pretty much perfect. It has so damn much WARMTH. When Craig sings that the nights are hot and hissing, everything in the sound of the song backs it up. The entire song sounds like a night too hot to be up to any good, like the night’s playing tricks, and you know it will evolve into something bad. Romantic and huge, but still on it’s toes, in a way. I really like that sound.
And the takeoff near the end of the song (“You came back to us!”) are perfectly timed and tempered. It drips of a mix of desperation and determination, a firmness and total belief. The part where he goes on with “Man, it feel pretty magical”, feels so earnest, and like a real-time revelation is going down in front of his eyes.
I’m almost talking myself into pushing this further up the list, but even if I think it’s pretty perfect, I think they do songs in other styles in a just as perfect way, and I like the style of those songs even better. Still, I’d like to express how good this song really is. I think it’s a slightly forgotten gem. Final points: - It was quite a revelation to me when somebody casually dropped by the Here Goes thread to say that The Ambassador was the name of the hotel where Robert Kennedy was shot. I had no clue about it, though it sound like a piece of information I'd usually pick up - I've already started it, so I might as well keep dropping some personal highlights from my career as a fan. It's silly to feel giggly proud about these things, but I guess I'm in a place where acceptance for such feelings can be found.My daytime job is in the norwegian parliament, as an advisor in a political party. At my first post Teeth Dreams show, an extremely sweaty and intense London gig, they played The Ambassador. And when Craig sang the line "it wasn't much diplomatic there", he pointed straight at me and grinned. I was pretty sure it wasn't a coincidence, and whem I read this interview a few years later, I became certain. I'll leave it up to you to find the quote, haha: www.clashmusic.com/features/good-trip-bad-trip-craig-finn
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Post by muzzleofbees on Apr 10, 2021 14:47:18 GMT -5
So one thing I never realized until a few years ago is that there aren't any repeated choruses on the first record. Repeated lines, sure, but no Rock Song Choruses. And none on the second record excepting Hoodrat, and that's just a single line getting repeated. And I LOVE that. I generally love verses and deal with the chorus. But I heard those first two records and liked them enough to buy the third but didn't like them enough to skip seeing Built To Spill for the fiftieth time at the big muddy-sounding Crystal Ballroom even though a few blocks away the Hold Steady were playing at little Berbati's, with USE opening in summer 2005. Then the third record catches me by my tail, because of the immediacy of the choruses on the first three numbers and First Night and even the stupid acapella Southtown intro. But caught me enough to listen closer to those first couple records and really GET them. And I'll take the first couple over the third every day of the week but it took those big choruses to open my eyes (ears I guess). Anyway, I can absolutely see someone at Vagrant sitting them down and having the Chorus Talk. "Look guys I know big rock choruses are passe but you can do them well and Hoodrat proves it and that just so happens to be your biggest number. And you can keep playing clubs to the cool kids but choruses are gonna put butts in the seats." It took me quite a while to realize that a lot of the earlier songs where verse and/or chours-less myself. I think it's just because I allready listened to a lot of music who wasn't too concerned about strict and traditional song structures. For one, Bob Dylan does it all the time, though he usually just repeats long, like-sounding verses. But also bands I've loved for most part of my grownup life, like Neutral Milk Hotel or Wilco, long time favourites like The Shins or Modest Mouse, have plenty of songs who shifts between different themes and parts within their songs, without ever making one of them a defined chours. But Boys And Girls really is something different. I haven't thought that much about the change in song structures, but you're totally right - with Chips Ahoy! maybe the prime example. I could also totally envision the converstaion between the label and the band, but I actually feel pretty sure that it was the other way around. That this was a very deliberate decision by the band, and that chosing a label with a little more commercial profile, was a result of that. I think it's sometimes underestimated, or at least under-discussed, that Hold Steady always have seemed like a really ambitious band. And it's always a bit hard to phrase what I mean by that, cause so many ideas about rock'n'roll (and especially anything on the fringe of "indie", in any reading of the word) is rooted in ambition being equalled with either cynicism and/or compromising in some way. I make no moral judgement at all, I just think it's interesting to observe.
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Post by muzzleofbees on Apr 10, 2021 14:48:26 GMT -5
First off, I'm really enjoying reading this even when I don't agree with it. Case in point, I realized the other day when this played that it's my least favorite Hold Steady song. Like I don't like it / would never want to hear it at a show, even though it's rare / don't think it's good. Thanks! And I have no problem understanding that at all. I think Wait A While is that song for me.
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Post by muzzleofbees on Apr 10, 2021 15:19:50 GMT -5
#38: RECORDS AND TAPES
Another Teeth Dreams era song, and another case of a b-side/bonus track might get a little more attention than it deserve. Or is that the right way to put it? It’s impossible to imagine it being in any other way, but if Records And Tapes were a proper Teeth Dreams track, I might evaluate it differently. When being able to listen to it on it ’s own, often as a single track I choose to put on, it’s possible it gets a certain glory the regular album tracks never will be able to achieve.
That said, I do really love this song. There’s few tracks in the catalog where Craig sound so turned on, with determination and intensity, almost a sense of anger. It’s all very subtle, and you might not hear the same thing, but I hear him deliver this song like it actually means a hell of a lot to him, more than usual.
The music is pretty much spot on to. A very melodic tune, with plenty of small licks and twists, nothing proggy or extravagant, just small details that spice up a pretty straight forward rock song and make it emotional and banging at the same time.
And I have to admit it feels almost like a breach in the fourth wall when Craig rounds it off with “Every single story have a few different versions( you tell the one who makes you look better”.
Final points:
- You know how I talked about how quite a few songs I like have this very vivid visual representation in my head? Well, this song puts me in a certain kebab shop in Oslo, one I never had been to before this night, and never have been back to, sending a text message to a person mentioned in the The Ambassador relevant Craig interviw I linked upthread. I can't even remember where I had been, I remember having a few beers, but not being drunk. And I can't quite put my finger on why my brain thinks this memory is worth holding on to. Maybe because I was listening to this song. - Craig is a sucker for these pairs, isn't he? Shoes and socks, curves and nerves and records and tapes.
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Post by muzzleofbees on Apr 10, 2021 15:25:46 GMT -5
#37: CURVES AND NERVESWhat I said about Records And Tapes might apply to Curves And Nerves too. I think it’s hard to argue that this objectively (which makes no sense, but again, for the sake of the argument, and you get what I mean) is a better song than many below it on the list. But this, as we have established, is a personal ranking of personal enjoyment per 2021. And that makes Curves And Nerves a contender for the top third of the list.
When I describe Hold Steady to people, I find myself describing them implicitly like a one trick pony. The way Franz described the band when he left (guys with this “one big idea” of rock’n’roll). I don’t really mean that, I just try to adjust for the decade-and-a-half of digging into nuances, nuances I just don’t expect people to hear right away. And maybe even to lower the expectations a little, cause you know, when you rave on a about a band, people sort of think they will be blown away. Hell, even I wasn’t blown away the first time I heard Separation Sunday.
This is a long way around what I meant to say: Going through the catalog song by song actually shows how big Hold Steady’s span in sound and style under the big rock umbrella really is. And this is yet another song who really have few songs like it. It reminds me of Pavement, or at least some undefined, fuzzy and raw 90s indie rock. And it almost tips over into the goofy when Craig doubles his own voal in the second verse. I just love this kind of indie rock, it was everything I spent time with before I discovered Hold Steady, and it’s so nice to hear them do a song like that.
Plus, it’s a great Hold Steady song too, in the way that they keep on addind intensity to this very slacker like tune, and the eruption at the end (“Charlemagne in a shallow grave!”). It just a very fun and moving song, and I keep coming back to it more often than looots of other tracks. Final points: - The twist on the titles, turning them into porn, is both very cheap, very clever and very funny - There's also a certain Lifter Puller touch to this song, and their first album sounds very Pavement-y at times - One of the most obscure Hold Steady related LPs I own, features Curves And Nerves. The most informative link I could find after three or four Google searces, was this: forum.dvdtalk.com/music-talk/346909-ladies-gentlemen-magazine.html
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Post by muzzleofbees on Apr 10, 2021 15:37:59 GMT -5
#36: SPINNERS
Spinners is maybe the last really HUGE poprock song Hold Steady made. I know Family Farm could compete here, but I just think Spinners has an arena and/or radio like aura that is a little bit gone with Hold Steady v2.0. We’ve gotten something completely else in return, and I’m not complaining at all. It’s just a neutral observation: They don’t seem to do this kind of super slick, emotionally button-pushing digs at the mainstream anymore.
Still, with all the fuzz and gloss on top of this song, it as a rawness to it. The way the guitars seem to play off the beat of the drums in the intro, the way they add a little drama in the pre-chours and the way they explode in the real chours. And how about that little lick that appears after “you gotta get back out there”?! That multi-note little figure is so, so appealing, and it’s a 100% right decision to pick it back up in the outro as well. Little details like this can lift a song majorly for me, and in Spinners, this is the icing on the cake.
If I have anything to object to here, it’s for once Craig’s lyrics. They just seem a little simplistic and repetetive in the verses (the entire get him/want him thing is borderline cringey) and there seem to be a few non-relevant repetitions of words/images/tropes, not for the sake of self-referencing, but cause of lack of better ideas. I wouldn’t say this if I didn’t praise Craig in about every other text in this thread, and it doesn’t exactly bother me listening to it, but it’s one of few slightly negative points about Spinners, who I’d love to hear a little more frequently live.
Teeth Dreams wrapped up
We've now reached the first entry on this list who also is the last entry from an album/era, and as we're approaching #1 I will let you know when you can't expect to see any more songs from that particular album.
No song from Teeth Dreams rank higher than Spinners on this list.
That means that the following songs failed to make the top #100
On With The Business Wait A While Oaks Look Alive
I get that a couple of these might be controversial omissions. Let's start with the one I guess is the biggest: Oaks. I totally get that people love Oaks, that they have strong emotional ties to it. But it's never really done it for me. Maybe it is beacuse it is too sad, too much to take in. Or maybe it's just so far away from what I love about Hold Steady that it's been hard for me to really get a grip on it. Truth is, I've never really listened much to it. I know how it goes, and can hum good parts of it, but I don't even remember the full structure of the song. I should probably give it a few more spins, and even though it might not push it into the list, some pieces might fall into place.
On With The Business seems to be treasured by the band, at least. It keeps popping up very frequently in the setlists, also during residencies/string of shows where none other Teeth Dreams songs getting played. It has as lot of cool things about it, but it's also the purest "hard" song in the catalog for me. Even the chours is abrassive and un-welcoming, and I'm sorry, it will always be among my least liked tracks.
Same goes for Wait A While, which I kinda liked early on, but I know think is flat, simple and dumb. Is sounds over-written as a poppy song, and Craig's lyrics are particullary uninspired, or straight up bad. I still think Franz' dig at it back in 2014 was both uneccessary and a little cheap, and I don't by any means feels that this is problematic regarding Craig's way to write female characters, but I have to agree in some of the criticism too.
Finally, Look Alive is just not a very good song, if you ask me. Sure, it's competent enough, but there's just nothing in it who even tickles my emotions. A very strong contender for the worst ever Hold Steady song, though Just Sayin' might always be the one who tops that particular list.
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Post by thehudsonsteady on Apr 11, 2021 2:34:36 GMT -5
Hi muzzle! Thanks for bringing 'saddle shoes' and 'records and tapes' to my attention, I'd completely overlooked them and have enjoyed hearing them a lot. I have to say I'm shocked you've included big cig and almost everything at the expense of 'on with the business', but I love the way you're including the way a song may have an importance within THS' 'history' into your list. Your thoughts on 'spinners' were really revealing but I disagree on the lyrics, I love the way there's a lot of space in the words, they're very universal without being ultra specific for a change. Anyway, be warned, if 'Banging Camp' comes in outside the top 10 you'll be hearing from my solicitors!
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