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Post by star18 on Apr 6, 2021 15:31:41 GMT -5
This is an amazing story, thanks so much for sharing. I absolutely wouldn't know what to say if he asked me that.
This was the tune that first hooked me! It's funny, I was definitely listening to plenty of both indie and classic rock during the early 00s, and I'd heard the name of the band here and there, but for whatever reason they just never really came across my radar in a big way. I can't remember exactly how I found this song specifically, but once it got its hooks in me, it was all over. So while I'll agree the composition might not be their most inspired, I mostly feel incredibly grateful that this songs exists.
That said, I have had the same thought as you about the horns -- the arrangement is great but they're a touch "thin" (same on "Two Handed" for that matter). The Horn Steady takes it to a new level.
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Post by muzzleofbees on Apr 7, 2021 1:44:32 GMT -5
This was the tune that first hooked me! It's funny, I was definitely listening to plenty of both indie and classic rock during the early 00s, and I'd heard the name of the band here and there, but for whatever reason they just never really came across my radar in a big way. I can't remember exactly how I found this song specifically, but once it got its hooks in me, it was all over. So while I'll agree the composition might not be their most inspired, I mostly feel incredibly grateful that this songs exists. That said, I have had the same thought as you about the horns -- the arrangement is great but they're a touch "thin" (same on "Two Handed" for that matter). The Horn Steady takes it to a new level. I totally get people getting into Hold Steady through this song! I was allready deeply familiar with the first three records when Stay Positive dropped, and I guess that coloured my view of that record. That said, in this thread I try to be as honest as possible with myself in terms of how these songs feel to me right now - with some historical and contextual stuff as a adjusting component. And this song is definitely one I think of as very classic Hold Steady, in some way important in the story of the band on a broader level, but also to myself after hearing it live 20+ times. Yeah, there's something about the horns. I think they sound pretty good, it's more a strange feeling that they serve as decoration or something outside the song, while the more recent use of horns are way more integrated to the sound. They're not hidden as just another element in the sound, they play a very active part. And that sounds like a deliberate decision by Kaufman and the band. The good thing is that I know sort of look forward to hearing Sequestered In Memphis live. It's a way different beast now than what it was a few years ago.
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Post by muzzleofbees on Apr 7, 2021 14:45:26 GMT -5
#59: TOUCHLESS This is one of the most b-sidey songs in the entire catalog. It lacks momentum and doesn’t feel particular, I don’t know, loved - not by fans, and not by the band playing it either. But it’s a pretty sweet tune, smooth and swaggy. And I might like it as good as I do cause it’s a straight ripoff of another song I’ve heard about a hundred times: Some Might Say by Oasis, a band Tad is a spoken fan of. It’s not just the riff, but the guitar sound too, which is pretty cool, by the way.
I really like the breezy vibe of the song, and also the darknes lurking underneath. It starts out as a mundane song about the repetitiveness of touring, but as soon as the groupie/stalker puts her nails in the narrator’s back, it gets pretty weird. And I guess most of us have experienced that something seem to start off as soon as someone takes a bottle outside. Final points: - In this interview extract, Tad talks passionately about Oasis, and Craig is... well, not that amused: www.stereogum.com/11315/hold_steady_loves_oasis_sort_of/news/
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Post by muzzleofbees on Apr 7, 2021 14:47:32 GMT -5
#58: TRADITIONAL VILLAGE
As I said, I’ve tried to stay true to my own gut feeling about these songs, and just as Touchless isn’t a big or very relevant song in the catalog, Traditional Village feels a little minor. But it has this joy and brightness that appeals to me, and the horns are really nice. Such a nice intro, a verse with a breezyness to it, and real intensity - though still on the lighter side of things - when the band kicks in for the sort-of chours.
My favourite part is what goes on musically at the part where Craig sings “and we’re not in this alone/ 2000 light years from home”. It’s quite subtle, but there’s this longing and regret here, real solitude, but with bright blue sky above.
And I think the reason why I like it so much is cause it had been a while since Hold Steady knocked out so easy and care free tunes. Teeth Dreams had none of them, and even the most sparkling songs on Heaven Is Whenever had a little forced tension to them. Maybe this is an important song to understand why Hold Steady v.2.0 is so good: The low shoulders, and the sense of a band at ease?
Final points:
- At the Twitter listening party for Open Door Policy last week, Franz confirmed the handclaps on Riptown are real human hands, but that they used an 808 for the handclaps here - It's a curiously named song. What is the traditional village in this context? The band? The scene?
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Post by muzzleofbees on Apr 7, 2021 14:50:18 GMT -5
#57: 40 BUCKS
It seems like we’ve entered and entire segment of songs on the lighter side of things. 40 Bucks is pretty sad, and that little guitar lick the song is built on have tons of melancholy in it. But it’s still a light, a non-rocking song, full of air and space, and I really like that.
40 Bucks is sooo 70s radio to me, and I say that with close to none knowledge about what actually was played on the radio in the 70s. But still - this has an undefined notion of american-ness to me, music not connected to a scene or a city, not rock’n’roll, not country, not americana, just American. And the lyrics back that up too, that trope of a woman not ony in love with music, but with bands and musicians, getting knocked up by a guy in a “five piece out of Wichita”. I know the real depth in this song lies in how her daughter deals with it, but it’s that second verse who symbolize the song for me.
And even if it’s light, it’s really, really well written. Just a fine middle of the road song, and I think I can justify putting it close to the middle spot on this list.
Final points:
- As for "bucks" in song titles, I just point out that 40 is written with numbers, while the solo son Ninety Bucks is named with letters. Make of that what you will - It's fair to assume this song is about Jesse, and it's a really clever move to make her out to be "born into the only songs..." in Certain Songs, all 70s songs, and then drop this a few years later, which makes the phrase so much more literal
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Post by muzzleofbees on Apr 7, 2021 14:52:44 GMT -5
#56: STOVE AND THE TOASTER
This was a part of the thrid batch of double song releases in 2017/2018, and the point where I actually started believe that a real comeback was a possibility. I heard Entitlement Crew as a goodbye, and Eureka/Esther as something they recorded while they were allready on it, but when I sat on the veranda of my parents house in a Norwegian small town and blasted Stove And The Toaster through my built-in iPhone speakers, I thought “this could actually be it”.
It has something in similar with Eureka, in the way that it sound like Hold Steady replicating what Hold Steady once was about. But I think this updated version of Boys And Girls/Stay Positive era THS is a notch sharper and more on point. When I think of it, “sharp” is a quite fitting adjective. It feels slim and trimmed and clean, and the melodic touch in the chours hits all the right spots.
It will never be a huge Hold Steady rocker, but it feels like solid quality, in a way. And the lyrics are both funny (face value) and pretty dark (when you read a little around the boards) too.
Final points:
- I know this pictures a kitchen at any given time of the day, but I don't know that many rock bands who keep releasing songs referencing breakfast (Unpleasant Breakfast, but also setting the scene in Confusion In The Marketplace) - It's weird how those small Spotify cover images still make me associate songs/albums with their artwork. This song is totally orange to me, in my mind
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Post by muzzleofbees on Apr 7, 2021 14:54:56 GMT -5
#55: ONE FOR THE CUTTERS
A diplomatic #55 for a song who, depending on my mood, is both among the best and the worst for me. I think I need to be in the right mode for One For The Cutters, and I think that mode is an intellectual one. Emotionally, it’s never really sat right with me. That harpsichord is one thing, but there’s a general theatrical feel to the entire song that never grabbed me.
But it is kinda cool too. Innovative, bold and quite succesful in what I think it attempts to do. And as with so many other songs, it builds something on the way. When the townie falls in the forest, it’s grown into a great song-song. And that big and ringing sound of Tad’s guitar is amazing.
It’s so high up on the list out of respect more than love, but I feel the song have an important place in the catalog, both musically and narratively, and I wouldn’t fell quite right about putting it any lower.
Final points:
- I think it's really funny how Franz keeps pointing out that the harpsichord wasn't his idea - it was Tad's - The competition is fierce, but you'll struggle to find a single word in a song title with more different meanings packed into it than "cutters"
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Post by kayfaberaven on Apr 7, 2021 15:00:11 GMT -5
#71: WE CAN GET TOGETHERI’m not sure if there’s a collective opinion about We Can Get Together among fans. To me it seems like the song is a little forgotten. At the time it came out, it felt a little disappointing. Not only did it follow First Night and Lord I’m Discouraged (the big ballad at track #5), and did it in a very much more low key way. But it was also Hold Steady’s lushest, most rounded song to date. Everything about it is warm, cozy and embracing, all the way up to the angel choir near the end. If fans rejected it, I can understand why.
10 years later, I think it’s easier to really appreciate it as something different. An honest attempt on writing a heartfelt and shiny anthem to listening to music in a room together. And the alternative version on the reissue is arguably even better.
It’s not a song who really tell people what Hold Steady is about, and it might not be a song very many people actively put on either. But it’s nice and sweet, and if you just accept what it really is, I think it’s easy to enjoy it too. Final points: - This was actually a highlight for me from The Weekender in March. I didn't expect much when they went into it, but it turned out as a really majestic and big song, which I massively liked. I seem to remember a similar reaction from hearing it in a real live setting a couple of years back too, and I'm pretty sure it boils down to something Steve and Franz is cooking up. Neither of them played on the recorded version, and they've both talked about the fun in finding space for themselves in these songs they didn't originally take part in. I need to go back and check exactly what was so thrilling about it, but this is a decent guess, I think. I never really thought much about this song - it was average at best. But then the pandemic hit, and they played it during one of the Massive Nights in December, and I'd had just the right amount of booze, and the sound was perfect through my headphones, and other THS fans in the Zoom chat were getting emotional, and that moment was the closest a song has ever been to making me cry. There may have been some extra water in my eyes, but it never breached my eyelids! Also, "it’s nice and sweet" is what I always thought, but then I noticed Craig does the "business" air quotes when he sings "listen to your records" and now I'm not so sure.
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Post by star18 on Apr 7, 2021 16:30:37 GMT -5
Just wanted to say that I ADORE this song and think it's the best of the Stay Positive bonus tracks (well, maybe tied with "Ask Her for Adderall"). My only gripe with SP as an album is that I don't always love the mix decisions -- some of the big rockers (Constructive, Sequestered) sound too compressed/crunched up for my taste. In contrast, I think "40 Bucks" is absolutely perfectly mixed, with every instrument sitting just right. It's mind-blowing to me that this one didn't make this album (or get brought back for HIW).
My hottest of hot takes when it comes to THS is that I think you could construct an album solely out of their unreleased/b-side tracks that would be superior to any of the actual studio albums. Probably have to do a thread on that one someday.
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parock
Midnight Hauler
Posts: 1,000
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Post by parock on Apr 7, 2021 17:00:18 GMT -5
These rankings are wild! Muzzle has been on the boards for a minute so I take what they say seriously, but having Lord ranked lower than Navy Sheets is a take and half!!!
While I don't agree with the rankings all that much, love the detail and writing and time you put in. Salute!
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Post by muzzleofbees on Apr 8, 2021 2:23:05 GMT -5
These rankings are wild! Muzzle has been on the boards for a minute so I take what they say seriously, but having Lord ranked lower than Navy Sheets is a take and half!!! While I don't agree with the rankings all that much, love the detail and writing and time you put in. Salute! Haha, thanks. I totally get people will disagree on plenty of stuff here, it's a very personalized ranking after all. I think the rationale behind Navy Sheets vs Lord I'm Discouraged is something like this: They are pretty equal to me, in the way that I enjoy them more or less the same. But what song excite me most at this point in my life/being a fan? What song would I be happiest if they did live? And are there similar songs in the catalog that fullfil the same need, doing the same job? Those last two points gives Navy Sheets an edge. I get my fix of ballads elsewhere. In the exact same category, I prefer First Night, and if we expand to slower jamrs in general, also Certain Songs or Criminal Fingers. And if I'm standing front row at a show, I'd rather get the rare Navy Sheets, for the thrill of it, than another take on Lord I'm Discouraged. But if I tried to to an objective (which anyway is pretty meaningless, but for the sake of clarity) assesment of the quality of each song, I might put Lord I'm Discouraged a little higher (like Magazines, The Weekenders or Sequestered In Memphis). Glad you like the writing, though! Hopefully we find more stuff to agree on when we enter top 30.
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Post by muzzleofbees on Apr 8, 2021 2:26:01 GMT -5
Just wanted to say that I ADORE this song and think it's the best of the Stay Positive bonus tracks (well, maybe tied with "Ask Her for Adderall"). My only gripe with SP as an album is that I don't always love the mix decisions -- some of the big rockers (Constructive, Sequestered) sound too compressed/crunched up for my taste. In contrast, I think "40 Bucks" is absolutely perfectly mixed, with every instrument sitting just right. It's mind-blowing to me that this one didn't make this album (or get brought back for HIW). My hottest of hot takes when it comes to THS is that I think you could construct an album solely out of their unreleased/b-side tracks that would be superior to any of the actual studio albums. Probably have to do a thread on that one someday. Totally agree, the production/mix is fantastic. And in a way it points forward towards where Hold Steady are right now, with a sound with more space, air and room for details. I would love to hear a version of Constructive Summer with just slightly more dynamics in the mix. It is VERY compressed. And this might be my general hot take: Not only Stay Positive, but also Boys And Girls, suffer a lot from muddy, loud and crowdy soundscapes. I wonder how they made 40 Bucks so open and clear, in the midst of all of this.
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Post by muzzleofbees on Apr 8, 2021 2:29:02 GMT -5
I never really thought much about this song - it was average at best. But then the pandemic hit, and they played it during one of the Massive Nights in December, and I'd had just the right amount of booze, and the sound was perfect through my headphones, and other THS fans in the Zoom chat were getting emotional, and that moment was the closest a song has ever been to making me cry. There may have been some extra water in my eyes, but it never breached my eyelids! Also, "it’s nice and sweet" is what I always thought, but then I noticed Craig does the "business" air quotes when he sings "listen to your records" and now I'm not so sure. It sure fits the pandemic, and the weird experience of a remote concert very well! I remember Craig did big, emotional intros to it early on, talking about how this song was about bringing people together in a room, sharing a musical experience. I think he still does. And with the year we have behind us, those words take on a new and heavier meaning. Haha, the quote marks is funny. I guess they're really all over like 80% of their songs, only this time it was made explicit. I think it's a case where you can choose to hear it in an innoncent, or in a not so innocent way.
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Post by skepticatfirst on Apr 8, 2021 10:58:23 GMT -5
I would love to hear a version of Constructive Summer with just slightly more dynamics in the mix. It is VERY compressed. And this might be my general hot take: Not only Stay Positive, but also Boys And Girls, suffer a lot from muddy, loud and crowdy soundscapes. I wonder how they made 40 Bucks so open and clear, in the midst of all of this. I'm having trouble keeping up with this thread in terms of how much it's given me to think about, but in fact yesterday I was just thinking, on the basis of what you've had to say about individual songs, that it's really making me rethink BAGIA and Stay Positive specifically. Not so much because of the muddy/crowded sound, but because of the way you've framed the albums. BAGIA as that poppy trio of PP-YCMHLY-MN, Stay Positive as the album not of CS/SP, but of OftC/NS/BCrosses festooned by a ballad and a pop song. The fact that this reframing is even possible means that these albums are a far less certain affair than AKM or SS, even though I've always tended to put BAGIA at least in a category with those first two albums. Keep it up, this is great stuff.
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Post by muzzleofbees on Apr 8, 2021 14:02:14 GMT -5
I would love to hear a version of Constructive Summer with just slightly more dynamics in the mix. It is VERY compressed. And this might be my general hot take: Not only Stay Positive, but also Boys And Girls, suffer a lot from muddy, loud and crowdy soundscapes. I wonder how they made 40 Bucks so open and clear, in the midst of all of this. I'm having trouble keeping up with this thread in terms of how much it's given me to think about, but in fact yesterday I was just thinking, on the basis of what you've had to say about individual songs, that it's really making me rethink BAGIA and Stay Positive specifically. Not so much because of the muddy/crowded sound, but because of the way you've framed the albums. BAGIA as that poppy trio of PP-YCMHLY-MN, Stay Positive as the album not of CS/SP, but of OftC/NS/BCrosses festooned by a ballad and a pop song. The fact that this reframing is even possible means that these albums are a far less certain affair than AKM or SS, even though I've always tended to put BAGIA at least in a category with those first two albums. Keep it up, this is great stuff. I think this is a product of foucsing in on the songs instead of the albums, at least to me. And I have thought about this before: How Stay Positive is a pretty major change, with half the album consisting of quite left field choices. I rate it a lot less than many others, but I still think it's a pretty damn fine sequenced and constructed album, and all the songs who might feel a little off standing alone, works surprisingly well in context. Since we're on this: If I were to make a short blurb for each album, in terms of what kind of Hold Steady album it is (not describing just as an album, to someone who's never heard it before, but as a Hold Steady album, described to someone who knows the catalog well), it would be something like this. Almost Killed Me: The raw and fun rock exercise, the sound of a band blissfully playing music together, without too much thought about how the public will recieve it (though I do believe they gave that a lot too, it just doesn't sound like it, if that makes sense) Separation Sunday: The very focused attempt of refining those AKM ingredients into something much bigger, more coherent - a statement album. Tight, controlled, but still very much bubbling with ideas and joy. This is in stark contrast to what sophmore albums usually is. It's a lot more common that bands spend their first album blasting ideas they've spent a lifetime developing, and when the time comes to knock out the follow-up, it's harder. But Hold Steady came to life when the members were older, and had experiences from being in bands before, which I guess made them able to do it. Boys And Girls In America: The shot at the bigtime, rounding off a few edges, while maintaining their main purpose, more poppy, more senitmental, a little weariness have crept in, but it mostly comes off as stylistic fitting. The perspective have shifted a little. On the two first albums we're in the midst of it, out in the streets where stuff happens. On Boys And Girls things feel a little more past tense, like the narrator of it all reminisce over what went down, with a few drops of romantic sentimentality. This is reflected in Craig's voice too, more singing, less talking, a little softer around the edges. Stay Positive: The sentimentality have turned into something a little harder, even more bitter. There's reminiscing here too, but everything is darker and more unforgiving. It's more experimental, within some boundaries. I think this is where the weariness really shines through, probably a mix of deliberate choices musically and real-life weariness from hectic touring and the burden of being a band trying to make it. Heaven Is Whenever: In one way, the comedown and the disappointment, but also a return to some of the romanticism from Separation Sunday/Boys And Girls. I have a feeling that these stories are more present tense, in the way they're told. Not like this is Craig singing about his life in 2010, but that the narrator in the songs are telling the stories from a here-and-now perspective, rather than looking back. The shiny production might fuel this perception. A little light on ideas, but it feels a lot more playful and joyous than interviews in hindsight suggest it was. Teeth Dreams: The little forced attempt of a comeback. Tries a little to hard to make those guitars guitar-y, the toughness and rock'n'roll sounds more like a outcome of a band meeting than something flowing freely and spotanious. Not so dark, but certainly hard. And the soft tunes feel almost to deliberate soft. I always thought this album felt over-thought. Or at least that the thought of what this was supposed to be shines a little too much through (again, if that makes any sense). Thrashing Thru The Passion: The sound of a burden being lifted from their shoulders, and that the realization that it's too late to really Make It gives freedom. It lacks a little in the ideas departement, but who can expect a band to re-create the creative spark 100% fifteen years in? Still, a real comeback. Open Door Policy: The realization from Trashing taken one step further: The freedom translates into ambitions again. If you don't have to repeat the success formula from the early days, why not try to create something different, but maybe just as good (or even better)? Steve talked about the dreaded M-word (mature), but I think they should be proud of it. This is a mature album, and that's what makes it so damn good, playing up strenghts they've never really shown. This is just from the top of my head, and since this allready is an ego boost of a thread, and you guys reading this still tag along, I took the freedom to just write it out.
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Post by muzzleofbees on Apr 8, 2021 14:06:44 GMT -5
#54: CITRUS
It’s a little weird people don’t love Citrus even more. It’s such a natural type of song to be cherished by the fan base, a semi deep cut on a big and popular album, stylistically different, sweet and warm. Maybe fans of a band like Hold Steady are so conventional, and free of the need of contrary takes, that the big songs become the most popular songs?
Anyway, that’s a digression. I once loved Citrus, but like many others, I keep coming back to the real rock songs when push comes to shove. Still, it’s damn sweet. The plucking intro, the tons of bittersweetness in both melody and lyrics, and that I’ve Just Seen A Face-imitating rythm when the chours finally arrives.
I’ve always wondered if Craig watched The Wire while writing this, and though I realise that’s a very simple and obvious reference to make, and that there’s plenty of other sources of inspiration for a song like this, there’s something about “pagers”, “pistols” and “corners” in quick succession. And the core line here, “Lost in a fog…”, is hearbreaking.
Final points:
- The first (pretty much) acoustic song in their catalog, though 212-Margarita apparently stems from the Separation Sunday era - I know it's easy to tie this to the narrative once you're into that stuff, but on the surface, the lyrics here is a symptom of Craig's shift towards writing more universal songs, and probably also of the notion that this COULD turn big. I think being a 22 year old Norwegian, it helped a lot - this thing about the bar room being the a place of hope, where souls gather, is an easy sell.
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Post by muzzleofbees on Apr 8, 2021 14:11:18 GMT -5
#53: THE WEEKENDERS
The Weekenders always seemed to me like a perfect rock song - on paper. I don’t know much about neither music theory or composing music, but as a listener, it comes off as a slick and shiny beast, hitting all the right buttons. I imagine it would get straight A’s at school of rock.
But it has never really grabbed me, not in that way. It feels almost to perfect, constructed, in a way. I can totally feel the presence of the band, but there’s few things in the composition or performance who reveal the human touch. There’s a state of total control, with nothing left to chance.
I’ve been obsessing over Hold Steady’s abiility to write great bridges, and I’ve never really thought about it, but The Weekenders is missing one! Maybe that's it? We get a competent Tad solo, but there’s no middle part here which rips up the formula. It’s strange sitting here writing about a song I know so well, and realising I’ve never thought of this.
The saving grace is hearing the song live. From the atmospheric stuff Steve adds in the intro, to actually watching Craig’s face while delivering the opening lines about the horses. And the liftoff into the chours feels more real to, when there’s a little grit to it. It makes me remember how much I love this band, and especially how transcendent it can be watching and hearing them in a real, physical room.
Final points:
- If I remember correctly, this is one of only two songs Craig explicitly have called sequels or direct follow-ups. This obviously continue the storyline from Chips Ahoy!, and Frighten You as a follow-up to Sweet Payne - I have a good friend who's both a Hold Steady fan and a musician/guitarist. He loves this song. I've always thought this might be a sign of what I wrote further up: This is a song a musician will enjoy more than a straight listener, but I could read too much into it
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Post by muzzleofbees on Apr 8, 2021 14:26:04 GMT -5
#52: CRIMINAL FINGERS
Criminal Fingers sounds pretty unique to me, it has few companion pieces in the catalog. Milkcrate Mosh is somewhat similar, and when I think of it, Open Door Policy have a few in the same vein (The Feelers, especially). I hear this as a dark, creepy song, where demolition lurks just around the corner. A little like a horror movie, before the killer even appear, just that lurking feeling that’s something not quite right. Lots of atmosphere, but not enough information to tell exactly what’s wrong.
It’s some magnificent guitar work here, and I love the solo.
I can understad why it didn’t really fit on the album, and it shines maybe even brighter in its own right. There’s not a big melody to carry things here, the whole point of the song is the meandering, slightly creepy vibe in everything. I could have pushed it even higher, but I think I appreciate it even more as an antithesis and a carrier of a different perspective, so this seems about right.
Final points:
- A HUGE highlight of Massive Nights 2019 - I think I only recently really payed attention to the song. I bought the The Bear And The Maiden Fear 7" when it came out, but I don't think I listened much to it. And Criminal Fingers were never on Spotify either, so a couple of Youtube spins was pretty much it back in 2014.
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Post by muzzleofbees on Apr 8, 2021 15:42:58 GMT -5
#51: ESTHER
Another song who felt like a first. That sweet Wurlitzer is so present, and gives Hold Steady a whole new dimension. And everything about this song sounds relaxed and confident. It’s not a statement-like song, it’s just a song, a good one, performed with light hands and full belief that this will be good, that people will like it.
I’m not suggesting Hold Steady as a band at any point were insecure, but I think they at certain points in their carreer made decisions where the public reception had an influence, and that they were concerned about what choices they made would say about them as a band. Esther seems to abanndon that, not because it’s that left field or free of compromise - rather contrary, because it’s a very sweet and simple song, and that’s considered enough. Carefree and happy. That sounds good to me.
Final points:
- "Baby, that sounds biblical" = killer line - I'm not sure if I'll get another chance to bring up this general point, so I might as well do it here. The bridge, with the change of name an the detectives, reminds me of what Craig does better than anyone I've ever heard or read: He construct these conversations or quotes who reveal enough to give you a few pieces of the puzzle, but not enough to let you form the full picture without filling in the blanks. It's an almost enthymemic way to a) write conversations, and b) write lyrics in general, and it's a lot smarter than what he gets credit for. So often I implicitly ask myself: "What kind of people would phrase something like that?". Jester & June have maybe the best line to explain what I mean. Near the end, a segment of the song dives straight into a situation with a quote: "Honestly, offices/ that's a really good question/ I'm just kinda distracted/ by those jangling handcuffs/ and the flashlight in our eyes". It's a damn funny scene, but it's also revealing-but-not-really of what's gone down before the cop shows up. And the "that's a really good question", put in there without revealing the question, is just mindblowingly smart written. I can't quite put it in any better way, but I think you catch the general notion of this. If not, you can turn to Warren Zevon's Lawyers Guns And Money, who's pretty much the blueprint for this way of writing - Craig just pushes it into new, and way more complex territory.
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Post by muzzleofbees on Apr 8, 2021 15:53:14 GMT -5
#50: ALMOST EVERYTHING
I’ve never really listened much to Led Zeppelin, but this is kinda what they sounded when they turned the amps down, right? The whole song has a very retro feeling to me - something about the sound on the guitars, the druggy and hazy fog surrounding everything, Craig singing from a dream like state. Everything seems super slo mo, alright.
All of this elevates what at it’s core is a really beautiful song into something even more moving. There’s a subtext here, not only in the nostalgia and sadness, but also in the sound and the almsot physical notion of something out of reach, or something long lost.
It’s strange how this feels like a departure from the rest of Teeth Dreams, being so light and acoustic, but the way the song’s played and produced, makes it very capital-R Rock anyway. This isn’t just an acoustic song, it’s the type of acoustic song a juggernaut rock band would make. Hence the Zeppelin vibe.
Final points:
- I think it's a far too simple reading, but the first time I heard this, I couldn't help thinking there was a nod to Franz here. Craig have talked about it in interviews later on, that he felt Teeth Dreams lacked keys. And even when it arrived, these lines felt like they already admitted it: "Remember the feeling, remember the sessions/ how we made a connection/ the lambs from my dreams looking up at your hands/ your hands pointing up at the sky". It's far more plausible that it points back to the broader narrative, but my inital thought was "Franz". - There's an unparalelled soreness in the "I can hear you breathe" part
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Post by kayfaberaven on Apr 8, 2021 17:19:34 GMT -5
#50: ALMOST EVERYTHINGI’ve never really listened much to Led Zeppelin, but this is kinda what they sounded when they turned the amps down, right? The whole song has a very retro feeling to me - something about the sound on the guitars, the druggy and hazy fog surrounding everything, Craig singing from a dream like state. Everything seems super slo mo, alright.
All of this elevates what at it’s core is a really beautiful song into something even more moving. There’s a subtext here, not only in the nostalgia and sadness, but also in the sound and the almsot physical notion of something out of reach, or something long lost.
It’s strange how this feels like a departure from the rest of Teeth Dreams, being so light and acoustic, but the way the song’s played and produced, makes it very capital-R Rock anyway. This isn’t just an acoustic song, it’s the type of acoustic song a juggernaut rock band would make. Hence the Zeppelin vibe. Final points: - I think it's a far too simple reading, but the first time I heard this, I couldn't help thinking there was a nod to Franz here. Craig have talked about it in interviews later on, that he felt Teeth Dreams lacked keys. And even when it arrived, these lines felt like they already admitted it: "Remember the feeling, remember the sessions/ how we made a connection/ the lambs from my dreams looking up at your hands/ your hands pointing up at the sky". It's far more plausible that it points back to the broader narrative, but my inital thought was "Franz". - There's an unparalelled soreness in the "I can hear you breathe" part For the longest time, when I went to bed and needed a distraction to fall asleep, Almost Everything was my go-to. Usually I'd be asleep before the song ended, and if not then I get to go right into Oaks. I'm not sure I've ever still been awake by the time Oaks ends.
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Post by skepticatfirst on Apr 8, 2021 18:25:38 GMT -5
For the longest time, when I went to bed and needed a distraction to fall asleep, Almost Everything was my go-to. Usually I'd be asleep before the song ended, and if not then I get to go right into Oaks. I'm not sure I've ever still been awake by the time Oaks ends. Wow. Oaks is the one song that I can't listen to unless I'm really ready for it --- the feeling of being in a taxi with a girl who's not just leaving, but who you know is really going to die, is just overwhelming. There's maybe only a handful of times I've listened to the album without deliberately stopping it after Almost Everything. Going to sleep with it ... I'd be afraid of my dreams.
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Post by skepticatfirst on Apr 8, 2021 18:41:07 GMT -5
#51: ESTHERAnother song who felt like a first. That sweet Wurlitzer is so present, and gives Hold Steady a whole new dimension. And everything about this song sounds relaxed and confident. It’s not a statement-like song, it’s just a song, a good one, performed with light hands and full belief that this will be good, that people will like it.
I’m not suggesting Hold Steady as a band at any point were insecure, but I think they at certain points in their carreer made decisions where the public reception had an influence, and that they were concerned about what choices they made would say about them as a band. Esther seems to abanndon that, not because it’s that left field or free of compromise - rather contrary, because it’s a very sweet and simple song, and that’s considered enough. Carefree and happy. That sounds good to me. Final points: - "Baby, that sounds biblical" = killer line - I'm not sure if I'll get another chance to bring up this general point, so I might as well do it here. The bridge, with the change of name an the detectives, reminds me of what Craig does better than anyone I've ever heard or read: He construct these conversations or quotes who reveal enough to give you a few pieces of the puzzle, but not enough to let you form the full picture without filling in the blanks. It's an almost enthymemic way to a) write conversations, and b) write lyrics in general, and it's a lot smarter than what he gets credit for. So often I implicitly ask myself: "What kind of people would phrase something like that?". Jester & June have maybe the best line to explain what I mean. Near the end, a segment of the song dives straight into a situation with a quote: "Honestly, offices/ that's a really good question/ I'm just kinda distracted/ by those jangling handcuffs/ and the flashlight in our eyes". It's a damn funny scene, but it's also revealing-but-not-really of what's gone down before the cop shows up. And the "that's a really good question", put in there without revealing the question, is just mindblowingly smart written. I can't quite put it in any better way, but I think you catch the general notion of this. If not, you can turn to Warren Zevon's Lawyers Guns And Money, who's pretty much the blueprint for this way of writing - Craig just pushes it into new, and way more complex territory. The two TTTP-era songs that (excluding Entitlement Crew for sentimental reasons) have emerged as far and away my favorites are Esther and Star 18. It's just what you say --- a simple song (Star 18 I love for the opposite reason, because it's so ridiculously complex), but man, so fucking well done. I complained upthread about strained lines like "sure, they let you keep your handset" ... well, the whole opening verse of Esther is the exact opposite, lyrically flawless. Something about "ain't she the one that come up after Vashti," it's up there with "Mary got a bloody nose from sniffing margarita mix" and "and ended up all white and ecumenical" for me. So ballsy, pulling in outrageous images like it was nothing, so utterly in control of the meter and the run of syllables into the ear. The whole verse is right up there. And then the car scene is amazing too, for exactly the reasons you state. Great song.
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Post by skepticatfirst on Apr 8, 2021 18:45:10 GMT -5
Just wanted to say that I ADORE this song and think it's the best of the Stay Positive bonus tracks (well, maybe tied with "Ask Her for Adderall"). My only gripe with SP as an album is that I don't always love the mix decisions -- some of the big rockers (Constructive, Sequestered) sound too compressed/crunched up for my taste. In contrast, I think "40 Bucks" is absolutely perfectly mixed, with every instrument sitting just right. It's mind-blowing to me that this one didn't make this album (or get brought back for HIW). My hottest of hot takes when it comes to THS is that I think you could construct an album solely out of their unreleased/b-side tracks that would be superior to any of the actual studio albums. Probably have to do a thread on that one someday. Me too --- 40 Bucks and Ask Her For Adderall are for my money the best of that era (major soft spot for Constructive Summer aside). You should definitely do that thread ... how many tracks would the album need?
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Post by skepticatfirst on Apr 8, 2021 20:58:58 GMT -5
Separation Sunday: The very focused attempt of refining those AKM ingredients into something much bigger, more coherent - a statement album. Tight, controlled, but still very much bubbling with ideas and joy. This is in stark contrast to what sophmore albums usually is. It's a lot more common that bands spend their first album blasting ideas they've spent a lifetime developing, and when the time comes to knock out the follow-up, it's harder. But Hold Steady came to life when the members were older, and had experiences from being in bands before, which I guess made them able to do it. ... Thrashing Thru The Passion: The sound of a burden being lifted from their shoulders, and that the realization that it's too late to really Make It gives freedom. It lacks a little in the ideas departement, but who can expect a band to re-create the creative spark 100% fifteen years in? Still, a real comeback. Open Door Policy: The realization from Trashing taken one step further: The freedom translates into ambitions again. If you don't have to repeat the success formula from the early days, why not try to create something different, but maybe just as good (or even better)? Steve talked about the dreaded M-word (mature), but I think they should be proud of it. This is a mature album, and that's what makes it so damn good, playing up strenghts they've never really shown. This has been in my head the last couple of hours after reading your post (and possibly drinking) ... not to say obvious things, but 1) I say this loving AKM, including Sketchy Metal, beyond belief, but: Separation Sunday is a special work of art. 2) In retrospect, TTTP feels a lot like a third lease on life in the way that AKM was a second (post-Lifter-Puller) lease on life. 3) I don't really have a sense of what it means in 2021 that ODP was a top 10 album, but it does seem unexpected, and raises the question: what's next?
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