Post by tableinthecorner on Jan 1, 2021 15:02:42 GMT -5
I discovered something kind of cool about Charlemagne (although it’s not too obscure and there’s a chance someone has brought it up on this site before, so forgive me if that is the case). Before I get to the actual Talisman of Charlemagne, let me break down my thought process on this:
After reading through the phenomenal Here Goes thread (link) a few months ago, @skywaywalker (I believe) mentioned the Nelson Algren book The Man with the Golden Arm, a story about morphine addiction. This reminded me of something I’d read while researching Charlemagne: Louis XI commissioned the building of the Arm Reliquary, a golden arm that contains the ulna and radius from Charlemagne’s right arm (link). I put a picture of it below. Anyway, this isn’t the strongest connection considering the fact that the use of Nelson Algren in CSTLN could be attributed to Doublewhiskeycokenoice and nothing more, but Craig could have legitimately found a way to connect Charlemagne to addiction through Nelson Algren.
Flash forward to today when I was reading the latest post on the Alright Alright thread (link), and skepticatfirst brought up the existence of a Charlemagne-type emperor character in the Lifter Puller universe. Now this is another massive reach, but I considered bringing up a Lifter Puller lyric that always sounded a little Charlemagne-like to me: “All the gold that you’re holdin in your hands'' (SGS). The idea that Craig might’ve referenced Charlemagne’s gold arm in an early LFTR PLLR song when there’s no clear cut evidence that he even referenced it in any THS songs is extremely far-fetched. That line has a surface level meaning that actually makes sense, too- there’s no need to look any deeper. Still, there are people on this site who are able to consistently make something out of seemingly nothing (in a good way) when it comes to Craig’s writing. I thought it still could be worth posting, so I decided to do some more research on the golden arm and see if I could find anything of substance. I abandoned that because I discovered something even better.
The Talisman of Charlemagne. A talisman is an object, typically an inscribed ring or stone, that is thought to have magic powers and to bring good luck. That, in and of itself, sounds a little Hold Steady-esque to me, but still doesn’t mean anything. Here’s where things get really interesting, though. The Talisman of Charlemagne is the only surviving piece of goldwork which can be connected with Charlemagne himself- it is a 9th century medallion that he is said to have owned. In its center, it contains a fragment of the true cross (in the shape of a cross). It was originally set with two large sapphires in the middle with the hair of Mary in between them (link). That can’t all be a coincidence.
To me this is yet another piece of evidence that essentially confirms many of the story elements proposed by skepticatfirst in Here Goes. Charlemagne, as a Christ figure, was the victim of the famous THS crucifixion. I know that theory is pretty widely accepted among people who believe there is a THS story, but it proves something else as well: Sapphire is Mary of Barfruit Blues, 212-Margarita, etc.. The association of the two in the Talisman is a little too crazy, and when you combine that with the fact that Queen Mary (see Arms and Hearts, A Slight Discomfort, etc. for “princess” and Massive Nights and Stay Positive for “queen”) wore a sapphire bandeau (link), it’s almost undeniable.
At the very least, this goes to show how genius Craig’s lyrics are. This may not be anything groundbreaking, but if you’re reading this I hope you got something out of it- I thought it was pretty wild and worth sharing.
After reading through the phenomenal Here Goes thread (link) a few months ago, @skywaywalker (I believe) mentioned the Nelson Algren book The Man with the Golden Arm, a story about morphine addiction. This reminded me of something I’d read while researching Charlemagne: Louis XI commissioned the building of the Arm Reliquary, a golden arm that contains the ulna and radius from Charlemagne’s right arm (link). I put a picture of it below. Anyway, this isn’t the strongest connection considering the fact that the use of Nelson Algren in CSTLN could be attributed to Doublewhiskeycokenoice and nothing more, but Craig could have legitimately found a way to connect Charlemagne to addiction through Nelson Algren.
Flash forward to today when I was reading the latest post on the Alright Alright thread (link), and skepticatfirst brought up the existence of a Charlemagne-type emperor character in the Lifter Puller universe. Now this is another massive reach, but I considered bringing up a Lifter Puller lyric that always sounded a little Charlemagne-like to me: “All the gold that you’re holdin in your hands'' (SGS). The idea that Craig might’ve referenced Charlemagne’s gold arm in an early LFTR PLLR song when there’s no clear cut evidence that he even referenced it in any THS songs is extremely far-fetched. That line has a surface level meaning that actually makes sense, too- there’s no need to look any deeper. Still, there are people on this site who are able to consistently make something out of seemingly nothing (in a good way) when it comes to Craig’s writing. I thought it still could be worth posting, so I decided to do some more research on the golden arm and see if I could find anything of substance. I abandoned that because I discovered something even better.
The Talisman of Charlemagne. A talisman is an object, typically an inscribed ring or stone, that is thought to have magic powers and to bring good luck. That, in and of itself, sounds a little Hold Steady-esque to me, but still doesn’t mean anything. Here’s where things get really interesting, though. The Talisman of Charlemagne is the only surviving piece of goldwork which can be connected with Charlemagne himself- it is a 9th century medallion that he is said to have owned. In its center, it contains a fragment of the true cross (in the shape of a cross). It was originally set with two large sapphires in the middle with the hair of Mary in between them (link). That can’t all be a coincidence.
To me this is yet another piece of evidence that essentially confirms many of the story elements proposed by skepticatfirst in Here Goes. Charlemagne, as a Christ figure, was the victim of the famous THS crucifixion. I know that theory is pretty widely accepted among people who believe there is a THS story, but it proves something else as well: Sapphire is Mary of Barfruit Blues, 212-Margarita, etc.. The association of the two in the Talisman is a little too crazy, and when you combine that with the fact that Queen Mary (see Arms and Hearts, A Slight Discomfort, etc. for “princess” and Massive Nights and Stay Positive for “queen”) wore a sapphire bandeau (link), it’s almost undeniable.
At the very least, this goes to show how genius Craig’s lyrics are. This may not be anything groundbreaking, but if you’re reading this I hope you got something out of it- I thought it was pretty wild and worth sharing.
